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Eve
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 07:37 AM
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Goddess
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I know this is not a religious bulletin board, but I felt the need to share this. So, if you are not a "religious" person, you have the option of turning back NOW. Dont read any further, because I am sure you will find offense at this posting.
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Parents and students attending this yearís commencement at Georgetown University, a Catholic school, would surely expect to hear a commencement address that took Catholic teaching seriously. And thatís what they got. But many in the crowd were offended, even outraged.

The commencement speaker was Francis Cardinal Arinze, the head of the Vaticanís Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue. The dean who invited Arinze expected him to speak about the relationship between Christianity and Islam, especially in places like the Cardinalís native Nigeria.

Instead, Cardinal Arinze told Georgetownís class of 2003 that "happiness is found not in the pursuit of material wealth or pleasures of the flesh, but by fervently adhering to religious beliefs." Warming to his task, he then told graduates and guests about the importance of the family in Christian faith and life.

He said that "in many parts of the world, the family is under siege" as a result of what he called "an anti-life mentality [that can be seen] in contraception, abortion, infanticide, and euthanasia." Instead of being honored, the family is "scorned and banalized by pornography, desecrated by fornication and adultery, mocked by homosexuality, sabotaged by irregular unions, and cut in two by divorce."

Well, thatís a very Catholic message one might expect from a Catholic cardinal. But it proved too much for many in the audience. Teresa Sanders, a professor of theology, left the stage during Arinzeís remarks. Seventy other faculty members signed a letter to the dean protesting what one of them called Arinzeís "wildly inappropriate" remarks. Really? As a result, the dean apologized for the Cardinalís remarks and the "hurt" they caused.

This incident speaks volumes about the spiritual and moral condition of the West. As historian Philip Jenkins has written, the numerical and geographical heart of Christianity has shifted from the West to the developing world. One result of this shift is that, as was predicted, Christians from Africa are now evangelizing Europe and America, instead of the other way around.

Thus, we see Anglican bishops from Africa standing against Western apostasy by ordaining American clergy who will uphold historic Christian teaching on faith and morals. And we see Cardinal Arinze pointing out the damage being wrought by the Westís forsaking of these teachings.

The response to the Cardinal shows just how phony all the rhetoric about "tolerance" really is. Tolerance originally meant allowing people whom you believed to be wrong to live according to their beliefs without fear of reprisal.

It then mutated into the idea that all beliefs are equally valid. While this was mistaken, at least it allowed for the possibility that Christians might publicly express their beliefs. Now "tolerance" means that no oneóother than Christiansóshould ever hear anything that contradicts what they think, or otherwise upsets them. This is especially true if the subject is human sexuality.

This bogus definition of tolerance is why the dean felt the need to apologize for what the Cardinal said. Fortunately, our African brethren think otherwise. They take their faith seriouslyóseriously enough to tell the truth about the state of our souls, whether we like it or not.

There is hope in Africa, if not in Georgetown.
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Guest_JakeODonnell_*
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 01:25 PM
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georgetown university is a private college that needs $$$ from mainstream america. there are not enough kids who live in the dark ages to fill the campus.
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Dale
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 01:40 PM
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DARK AGES???
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Eve
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 04:18 PM
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Those back in the DARK AGES obviously had more sense than those today, otherwise we would already be extinct by now due to immoral behavior. God made Adam and Eve to procreate. Adam and Steve wouldnt have been able to fill that agenda.
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Wiggums
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 04:28 PM
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QUOTE
Originally posted by JakeODonnell
georgetown university is a private college that needs $$$ from mainstream america. there are not enough kids who live in the dark ages to fill the campus.


And that is from the VERY same person who objects to Liberals being called "decadent."

I guess we know where Jake stands.
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Guest_JakeODonnell_*
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 09:35 PM
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"Those back in the DARK AGES obviously had more sense than those today"

well, now tell THAT to galileo. why heck, tell that to every "witch" that was ever burned alive.

yep, it was quite fun being POPEnated back in those glory years known as the dark ages, eve.
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Banjo
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 09:38 PM
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QUOTE
Originally posted by Eve
Those back in the DARK AGES obviously had more sense than those today, otherwise we would already be extinct by now due to immoral behavior. ?God made Adam and Eve to procreate. ?Adam and Steve wouldnt have been able to fill that agenda.


*snickering*

and you're a teacher?

No wonder you get paid in peanuts.
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tAzMaNiAc
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 09:39 PM
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QUOTE
Originally posted by Eve
Those back in the DARK AGES obviously had more sense than those today, otherwise we would already be extinct by now due to immoral behavior. ?God made Adam and Eve to procreate. ?Adam and Steve wouldnt have been able to fill that agenda.


I take issue with that.

THose back in the dark ages did what the Muslims are doing now - killing everybody that doesn't agree.

Go read your history books.. (IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Remember.. the Crusades?
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tAzMaNiAc
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 09:44 PM
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What's more.. why should I believe the lying sacks of crap called Catholics? We've already found, what, 1,000 of them fornicating young boys. What else is next!

If Catholicism or CHristanity were indeed holy and all, this kind of thing WOULD NOT BE HAPPENING.

So I take the crap said just above with a grain of salt, and throw it out the window.

(IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Brenden
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Guest_JakeODonnell_*
post Fri Jun 6, 2003, 10:04 PM
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"Go read your history books.."

I'd suggest eve reads "The Demon-Haunted World" by Carl Sagan. Do your students a favor, read this book.
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deafgrrrl
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 08:04 AM
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QUOTE
otherwise we would already be extinct by now due to immoral behavior. God made Adam and Eve to procreate. Adam and Steve wouldnt have been able to fill that agenda
A wee bit homophobic aren't we? Do you perchance post at DumbMadness?
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Anja
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 09:30 AM
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QUOTE
Originally posted by tAzMaNiAc
What's more.. why should I believe the lying sacks of crap called Catholics? We've already found, what, 1,000 of them fornicating young boys. What else is next!

If Catholicism or CHristanity were indeed holy and all, [b]this kind of thing WOULD NOT BE HAPPENING.


So I take the crap said just above with a grain of salt, and throw it out the window.

(IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Brenden [/B]


emmmmmmmm Taz,,,,,,i'm catholic,,,,,not nice to generalize (IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

Yes, some of the catholics did some horrible things and need punished for it, actually burn in hell, BUT not all catholics are like that (IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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qwerty
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 09:54 AM
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QUOTE
Originally posted by deafgrrrl
A wee bit homophobic aren't we? Do you perchance post at DumbMadness?


Pez,

It's a fact, Adam and Steve cannot produce babies.
Secondly, to say something about immorality doesn't signify homophobicity just as it is immoral to steal as a sign of homophobicity.



(IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
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Dale
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 10:22 AM
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QUOTE
What's more.. why should I believe the lying sacks of ?
crap called Catholics? We've already found, what, 1,000 of them ?
fornicating young boys. What else is next!

If Catholicism or CHristanity were indeed holy and all, this kind of ?
thing WOULD NOT BE HAPPENING.

So I take the crap said just above with a grain of salt, and throw ?
it out the window.

Brenden


Why is it that when people who claim to be Christians do things
that PROVE they don't understand Christian theology, that folks
attack Christianity itself?

Show me in the Bible where these men were directed to molest
little boys, I dare you!

These perverts weren't Christians, they used the robes of
Catholic priests as a disguise.

When John Wayne Gacy used a clown costume to lure little boys
to their deaths, I didn't see ANYONE saying we need to get rid of
all clowns.

Why don't Christians get a little CREDIT form time to time, for the
good they do?

What about Christian groups in Africa, Asia, and India devoted to
freeing children from prostitution?

What about Christian Missions that bring medical, educational,
and nutritional help to third-world countries?

What about Christian-run soup kitchens and shelters right here in
America, that help the homeless?

And as for Christians holding back science, where would the
scientific world be without the likes of Gregor Mendel?

I think some of y'all need to step back, and take a FAIR look at
Christians, in general!
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deafgrrrl
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 11:33 AM
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qwerty, I've had sex ed since elementary school thank you very much! Certainly, same-sex couples cannot produce children in the way that hetrosexual couples do...so what? Need I remind you that some hetrosexual couples are infertile? They can't produce babies nautrally!
Some same-sex couples (especially lesbians) can produce children...need I remind you about the old turkey baster? True they can't make babies the traditional way, but they can adopt or go for test-tube babies or the like!
To me that remark about GLB sex WAS a homophobic remark!
She called homosexual sex acts immoral! Excuse me, but why are you so nosy? Why are you so judgemental? GLB people don't stand in your bedroom passing judgment on YOUR sex life!!!!! Are you perhaps one of those policemen in Bowers vs. Hardwick, where two consenting adult (of age) gay males were arrested for having sex...NOT in a public bathroom...NOT at a rest stop, NOT in public but in the privacy of their own bedroom!!!!!
Are you under the impression that GLB people are into KINKY sex? There are GLB people who are into kink,(and IMHO, those people are annoying as they seem to just be into the whole thing b/c it's TRENDY!) yes but there are just as many hetros who are into kink! (straight men who go to massage parlors and who frequent prosistutes to give just one example)
GLB people perform the same types of sex acts as do hetros and vice versa...I won't get graphic........but why is one sex act OK when performed in a hetrosexual context, but evil and dirty and (sometimes) illegal when it's performed in a GLB context?
You want wild and crazy and kinky sex? It's a proven statistic that those who enjoy the kinkiest sex tend to be the straitlaced conservative Republican type! Yes, I know...it's ironic but very very true!
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Dale
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 12:39 PM
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QUOTE
She called homosexual sex acts immoral! Excuse me, but why are ?
you so nosy? Why are you so judgemental? GLB people don't ?
stand in your bedroom passing judgment on YOUR sex life!!!!! Are ?
you perhaps one of those policemen in Bowers vs. Hardwick, ?
where two consenting adult (of age) gay males were arrested for ?
having sex...NOT in a public bathroom...NOT at a rest stop, NOT in ?
public but in the privacy of their own bedroom!!!!!
And who are YOU to say that folks like Qwerty and me who think
homosexuality is immoral are wrong?

Are we not allowed to have our own opinions?

I haven't seen Qwerty "stand(ing) in your bedroom passing
judgment on YOUR sex life!!!!!"

QUOTE
Are you perhaps one of those policemen in Bowers vs. Hardwick, ?
where two consenting adult (of age) gay males were arrested for ?
having sex...NOT in a public bathroom...NOT at a rest stop, NOT in ?
public but in the privacy of their own bedroom!!!!!


For the record, I think laws against homosexuality are stupid.

If a "sin" only involves consenting adults, in the privacy of their
own homes, then it's their choice.

If they don't even want to aknowledge that what they are doing
IS a "sin", then that's their choice.

But the only person I see here attacking anyone on the subject
of homosexuality, is YOU, DG.

One more thing:

This word "Homophobic" you keep throwing around . . .

Why in the world do you think Qwerty has an irrational fear of
homosexuals?

Just because you disagree with someone, doesn't mean you fear
them, now does it?
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qwerty
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 01:55 PM
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Q
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QUOTE
Originally posted by deafgrrrl
qwerty, ?I've had sex ed since elementary school thank you very much! Certainly, same-sex couples cannot produce children in the way that hetrosexual couples do...so what? Need I remind you that some hetrosexual couples are infertile? They can't produce babies nautrally!

And yet heterosexual couples, for the majority of them, still can produce babies au naturel.

QUOTE
Some same-sex couples (especially lesbians) can produce children...need I remind you about the old turkey baster? ?True they can't make babies the traditional way, but they can adopt ?or go for test-tube babies or the like!
So, we're in a Turkey Baster Generation and the Pepsi Generation is now out? Hmm...those turkey basters must be selling like hotcakes.

QUOTE
To me that remark about GLB sex WAS a homophobic remark!


QUOTE
She called homosexual sex acts immoral!
And where do you think this concept of "immorality" came from?
Immorality does not connote fear or phobic reaction as a result.


QUOTE
Excuse me, but why are you so nosy?

? To what extent am I "nosy", Pez, when I merely corrected the discrepancies?

QUOTE
Why are you so judgemental?
I have not showed an ounce of judgement on this discussion toward GLB people. However, you have on those who have shown an opinion/judgement on GLB people concerning
"immoralities".


QUOTE
GLB people don't stand in your bedroom passing judgment on YOUR sex life!!!!! ? Are you perhaps one of those policemen in Bowers vs. Hardwick, where two consenting adult (of age) gay males were arrested for having sex...NOT in a public bathroom...NOT at a rest stop, NOT in public but in the privacy of their own bedroom!!!!!

That's fine. They can do whatever they want to do in the privacy of their own homes. Who am I to interfere? I certainly do not want to be privy of the information on what gets them going in the bedroom or the basement.

QUOTE
Are you under the impression that GLB people are into KINKY ?sex? ?There are GLB people who are into kink,(and IMHO, those people are annoying as they seem to just be into the whole thing b/c it's TRENDY!) yes but there are just as many hetros who are into kink! (straight men who go to massage parlors and who frequent prosistutes to give just one example)
GLB people perform the same types of sex acts as do hetros and vice versa...I won't get graphic........but why is one sex act OK when performed in a hetrosexual context, but evil and dirty and (sometimes) illegal ?when it's performed in a GLB context? ?
You want wild and crazy and kinky sex? It's a proven statistic that those who enjoy the kinkiest sex ?tend to be the straitlaced conservative Republican type! Yes, I know...it's ironic but very very true!

Whatever floats your boat. That's fine. Some people consider same sex activities to be considered as "kinky" sex acts. However, you're getting way out of whack here, Pez.
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Sherry
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 03:54 PM
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No ALIAS until January 2005!!! EEK!
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QUOTE
Originally posted by deafgrrrl
It's a proven statistic that those who enjoy the kinkiest sex ?tend to be the straitlaced conservative Republican type! Yes, I know...it's ironic but very very true!


AH! So that's the secret to a wild and kinky sex life, I just need to become more straitlaced..... whoooo-hoo, MysteryShopper do you want to become more conservative? (IMG:http://www.click-smilie.de/sammlung/spezial/Fool/lu.gif) That's the goofiest "statistic" I've ever heard. Gee. Did all the Liberals put a sex barometer in all the Conservative's bedrooms or something? And the Liberals say, "Oh but not in mine please...we have our civil liberties to protect?" (IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

And I do think Dale has a point here. There are a lot of Christians who do a WORLD of good- and one cannot let the few bad apples spoil the bunch. For those who have no understanding of religion (and don't want to) one of my friends told me he felt the best thing one could do is remember everyone uses SOMETHING as a moral compass...and it may come in the form of religion. Nothing wrong with that as long as each of us have our own compass and don't try to force others to use ours.

Sherry
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Guest_JakeODonnell_*
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 04:07 PM
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deafgrrl sez: "A wee bit homophobic aren't we?"

me: unfortunately it is true. IMO a review of some of the posts in this forum by an outside and NEUTRAL third party will result in a simular conclusion.
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qwerty
post Sat Jun 7, 2003, 04:21 PM
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QUOTE
Originally posted by JakeODonnell
deafgrrl sez: "A wee bit homophobic aren't we?"

me: unfortunately it is true. IMO a review of some of the posts in this forum by an outside and NEUTRAL third party will result in a simular conclusion.


That "we" was directed at one person concerning "immorality" as being the definition of a homophobic response which is no more the making sense as with the discussion on the immorality of stealing as a cause celebre' for the deserved labeling as "homophobic", too.

Immorality does not equate as a phobia condition of a certain activity. If you dislike stealing, does that make you a kleptophobia?
(IMG:http://www.deafonline2.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
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